Do you actually want any business?

Gareth, its working out just fine for me, just not on here, i came here to try and help local business people but it just seems that the majority do not want the help or fear something different, i havnt got the time to spend ages developing relationships and getting to know how many sugars people have and what thier dog is called before they even accept a free service, i do not mean to offend members, maybe i got the whole concept wrong.

Yea fella you got the concept wrong D.

Let's not waste my time nor yours on a call tommorrow

David, and Brad will love this the meaning of Utopia, bearing in mind Iv'e studied a little bit of Greek history heres a snapshot

it proposes a categorization of citizens into a rigid class structure of "golden," "silver," "bronze" and "iron" socioeconomic classes. The golden citizens are trained in a rigorous 50-year long educational program to be benign oligarchs, the "philosopher-kings."

 

4N dont work like that, we dont sub divide people into categories or class, we treat them all the same. We enter the world as pond life and we leave as pond life and so to get back on point because this needs to be another topic, why didnt Glenns prospect reply to him.

I think that's patronising...it's almost as though you believe we should all simply shut up shop because you have been gracious enough to offer us your time free of charge. Aye right. 

Firstly, what are you offering? I have NO idea who you are or how good you are -  I can't see any testimonials on your website, I have no idea what I'm buying (or attending). 

I could set up a sales training business, create a 4N account and from everyone else's perspective, be in exactly the same position you are today.

I know some really capable sales trainers who I have read about and spoken to on this very forum, Adam Stevens from Mindcell in Southampton for example. I know he's good at what he does, he even made me want to buy from him, as a result I would probably go along to one of his training events, free or otherwise. 

Second, what is there to fear about sales training? It's sales training, you're not going into battle!

The vast majority of people who attend the SEO courses I deliver don't have a clue about SEO, and I've had quite a few 4Ners attend over the last two(ish) years I've been in business...4Ners tend to embrace things, in fact most small business owners will if they feel it will benefit them. 

Bertie Big Bollox has left the building

I don't think I am the only one but I do turn down business for a number of reasons. If a business looks big enough to take more than 5% of my turnover, I turn it down. If a business is involved in certain industries I turn it down. If my dog doesn't like the potential customer, I turn it down.

Result being a broad base of small businesses with very few bad debts and a good relationship with the business owners.

Gary

 

You're a sales trainer? Good manners is a basic starting point in sales. You must be amazing at all the other bits.

 

 

Interesting thread this, all coming down to one thing how people do business, ok not getting back to people,isn't right & I would never do it however there will be some companies out there who say they will give you a quote and never do, I've been a victim of that however I must say 4N people in my limited experience so far don't do that. Secondly David P you most certainly got the concept wrong, I'm a first aid training provider and I could have made my mind up in one meeting or two that I wasn't going to get any business out of it which is what you seem to have done, however I embraced the 4N concept and value the relationships & friendships I building with people, ok I havent had anyone come to me asking for first aid training yet but I'm not worried that will come I'm sure. For now I enjoy the banter & meeting new people, 4N was a breath of fresh air for me and has given me a new lease of life. I prefer to buy what I need from people I know and when I come to needing more for my business 4N will be my first port of call lets just hope I get the quote I ask for :)

For the record, i don't take any sugars in my coffee and my dog's name is Dave (although we haven't bought him yet...)

 

The irony of a sales trainer who can't sell free training!

Two sugars, milk. We have two dogs and a fish tank, do I win?

That's a fair point then. I've been around 4N since around about the time Brad started it, networking in and around Bristol and Bath for around 6 years. After a couple of years off I am back in networking land and chose to come back to 4N because of the culture - I wasn't wrong, I've already done some business and can see more will come.

It is however lamentable that some 4N members have failed to meet your requirements and as you said, perfect justification for not being able to recommend. My own take on it is this, if I dont want the business or am having trouble delivering on a promise - just say so. No-one seems to mind a bit of honesty.

 

 

I think part of the problem is people never saying "Sorry, we can't help you with this (because XYZ/but try ABC instead)".  Perhaps it's Britishness, but it seems far more common to promise them the world then do nothing in the hope they get the hint.  If you've sent the same enquiry to 5 different businesses, then it's less of a big deal, as hopefully one of them actually will get back to you, and will get the gig...but if you single out one business (due to MLKT or whatever) and they then blank you, it's infuriating not knowing where you stand.

I know from my own situation that we're not a suitable accountant for a lot of businesses.  So when I'm approaching a potential supplier I now nearly always keep it very brief and end the email with words to the effect of "if this isn't your kind of thing, let me know, I won't be offended", and I can then search for another supplier.

Personally, (no offence or actually possibly some offence), if I came across someone at any meeting anywhere in the world, 4N or no 4N, who said they were trying to "help" me and came across as possibly a bit arrogant, I'd run a mile.  It might well be working out well for you & good luck, but perhaps you could be getting even more business.  You may not mean to, but you come across as awful on here.  It might not work for you, and you might not understand it, but it works for a whole heap of people, including me!   

Perhaps the people you met at 4N are just smart cookies, who didn't quite take to you being not at all interested in who they are or what their business is about.  Good old business instinct.  More and more people are taking to dealing in "social" business in this way, you might even get left behind at some point, when the current people at the top become extinct. It's not about who signs up on the day, it's about who they know, who they recommend you to in or outside of 4N.  What makes you think that your business is so much more important than anyone else's that you have no time to forge any sort of business relationship.  Even the shameless big banks pretend to do this for their customers, why? Because they know people want to feel genuinely valued.

Oh and no sugar please! I'm sweet enough ... and my dog is called Frank, the customers love him AND he actually brings in business for us ... sometimes it's good to know the small things about your clients, no matter how high up they are, being GENUINELY interested (and most people can see through if you're not) & gaining the smallest nugget of knowledge, could be their's & yours biggest asset ... social business gets done on the golf course all the time, I bet if there was some hot shot there, you'd be falling over yourself to find out what he likes to drink in the club house after!!!!  Let's hope if it's coffee, you get the sugars right eh....

Good luck in your 4N-less future ... 

Three dogs (Benny, Maisie and Boris) and no sugars in my tea, thanks. Now that's out of the way I'm expecting the business to come flooding in.

It's strange when people don't come back to you when they say they will. If you don't want or can't handle a particular job (either out of your skill set or you've not got sufficient capacity within the timeframe) just say so - it's better for all concerned. Occasionally I think people have the intent and wish to do a job but they procrastinate or it gets pushed further and further back behind work on their desk there and then that it eventually becomes embarrasing to follow up on. Strange to find time to network but not to follow up on leads though.